Lynne, Jill and anyone else who is watching:

Did you see the "play" today that Jessica wrote to have a conversation with her dead mother? It was so touching. I think I wept as much during that as I did at Jessica's graduation. I loved Jessica commenting that Allison (playing her mother) went off-script at the end, but ended up saying things that Jessica said she could hear her mother saying.

I'd love to hear from any of you who are seeing these beginning-of-season episodes for the first time as to how it is changing how you think about the women.

I was a little disappointed at first, thinking the new eps were back starting today, but I was glad to remember this episode...it was a special one.

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
I guess what I think is unfair is this: what exactly is going to take place in 30 short days that will make a difference? What is the yardstick for this? Has anyone else ever been in this situation on another season?

I can't remember anyone ever being sent home for a "trial run" (though, when you think about it, this is what they started doing on The Biggest Loser this season and it makes perfect sense that you want to see whether someone can succeed in the real world before you call them "the winner").

People have been kicked out and sent home, with no chance of graduating, but I don't recall this "go home and MAYBE you'll graduate" situation ever happening before. OTOH, I think Lisa's situation is pretty unique. In all 3 seasons, you generally either have someone who is not ready to start over and will get sent home or you have someone who comes in, may be resistant the first few days or a week, but then goes "WOW, look how much this could help me." and embraces the process of change. You generally don't have someone like Lisa, who takes 4 steps forward and 2 or 3 steps backward...and I think there is some concern on Rhonda's part (there certainly is on mine) that Lisa is just play-acting her way to graduation. Esp. when I saw the line in her email to Mr. Internet where she said she was doing something "to placate my life coach."

Should be interesting.

P.S. I thought it was interesting how much Lisa was crying over leaving the SO girls and how bonded she was to them, when her attitude has often been that these women weren't her equals.

quote:

she needed to be "busted" on this attitude that she can do whatever she pleases and then cry and beg for forgiveness later.

That is so true. It is hard to fathom that the jail in the back yard-experience was not enough for her. It is a testimony to the strength of her will, though, and I wish that would have been pointed out to her. Like, look how hard you want things and learn to harness that. I guess what I think is unfair is this: what exactly is going to take place in 30 short days that will make a difference? What is the yardstick for this? Has anyone else ever been in this situation on another season?

Lynne

While I will agree that Kim has FINALLY done some really good work this past week, I didn't think it was fair for her to get an A at board of review (of course, I'm basing this on having watched 3 seasons of this show). I understand why Rhonda did it (in the voiceover, she says she gave Kim an A to give her encouragement to keep moving forward), but I still don't think it's fair based on her resistance and defensiveness. I think they gave her the A just based on the past few days.

As I said yesterday, I do feel sorry for Lisa, and I do want to see her graduate, but I'm glad that Rhonda didn't pussyfoot around with her at the board of review. Lisa needed to hear those things...she needed the reality check...she needed to be "busted" on this attitude that she can do whatever she pleases and then cry and beg for forgiveness later. It all needed to be said. That said, she has progressed too far in other aspects to get kicked out, so I thought that 30 days at home was a fair enough middle ground. The depressing thing about that is that she will probably end up graduating AFTER or WITH some of the brand new girls. One never knows on this show.

I have a feeling that, now that Jodi is opening up more to the process, she's going to be a fast graduater. I see her as being very much like Layne from last season, who just flew through her assignments and graduated in record time, even though there were times that things were pretty rough for her.

WELL, it's safe to say that you saw today's episode - ok, I wanted to sob but one of my kids (who already thinks I'm nuts because I watch this show) was in the room, so I held it in. I just think they had to put Lisa out because of all the build up, and sort of as an example. I picture writers and show producers and life coaches all sitting in a conference room figuring this out, the same way we parents put our heads together at times to figure out what we can take away next as appropriate punishment! But I do think it's awful, and even though Lisa has screwed up, I think sending her home for a month really is not fair. I was thinking that I hoped the housemates would be more loving to her that final night, and make her a take home care package of special lessons she could open in a box, or something.
I agree that Kim's last assignment was huge. Infact, at her board of review, I was encouraged about how well she is finally connecting with the girls.
Jodi is a treasure. She seems to be just blossoming from her guarded walled off persona, and has become the heart of the house, don't you think?
Quite the episode today, I look forward to your reaction
Lynne

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
Uh oh. Sheri, post after you watch today! I'm eager to see what you think of what happened!

I already have a bad feeling from the preview...I saw Christie crying and know that Lisa is potentially in trouble, so I'm really curious to see today's ep.

I don't know how you feel about it, but I'm a little sick of hearing Jill predicting Lisa being kicked out of the house. It's almost as if she WANTS her to be kicked out. Not to say I don't agree with Jill that Lisa has been given more "second chances" than ANYONE in Starting Over history, but it just seems pretty unsupportive to constantly be saying "Well, this time, she's gone."

While I felt bad for Lisa when she cried and said her family and friends all thought she wouldn't make it through SO and she didn't want them to be right, it's a case of "too little, too late." Yes, she has made progress, but for every step forward she takes, she leaps a yard backwards with some self-sabotaging behavior (the most obvious being Mr. Internet).

I'm glad you posted, actually, because I keep seeing things that I want to comment on but, since I generally don't ever get on the computer at home on worknights, I forget by the next morning to post it.

Your post reminded me that I wanted to remark on how: a) bowled over I was that Lisa actually pulled off that Tupperware Party (though she was a total "witch with a B" to her housemates beforehand); and b) touched I was by the "how unloved I feel" role playing that Kim did with various housemates standing in as her husband, aunt, grandma and grandpa. My already-established like/respect for Jodi grew because of how she handled herself in her role as "grandma." She was calm and loving and responded to Kim's comments with what seemed to me to be very appropriate responses.

Uh oh. Sheri, post after you watch today! I'm eager to see what you think of what happened!

Lynne

P.S. ...or anyone who is watching!

Awkward moments from today's ep...

Jill and Jody flirting with the dating doctor

Christie's phonecon with the bf about his supporting her when she's out

Kim wanting so much to "get it" but not (w/Rhonda in their 1-on-1)

The Kim vs. everyone confrontation engineered by Rhonda (to be contd Monday)

Silpada is a homeparty network with silver jewelry. I had one of their parties last summer,and found it pretty pricey. However, the appeal is that they don't do a presentation, so it's more like an open house.

Lisa+Tupperware was not a great fit, I agree. What I meant was that kind of business is a great start for her to learn the skills I've been waiting for someone to introduce her to.

Regarding Gilmore Girls, I have to say that I also watch it because my kids think Lorelei is the coolest mother ever, and of course, I'm jealous.

Lynne

Silpada is an "in-home" sales company. Kind of like tupperware, Longaberger, Mary Kay, etc. Interestingly enough, I am going to a Silpada show in two weeks(never been to one before) but it says on the card there is no formatted presentation, you get to browse the jewelry and purchase if you want.
Anyway I have not seen very much of SO
but have to say that even w/out seeing it I think Lisa definitely would be good at sales. I like to read your updates to get a glimpse of what has been going on.

PS: My dd and I LOVE Gilmore Girls too!!!

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
I dvr (tvo) everything and watch when I can, so I haven't seen the 2nd half of the new Survivor, but I know the woman you mean.

I don't know if you got to see the immunity challenge that began in the water. Lord have mercy. This same woman I'm talking about with the leaf problem was VERY close to flashing America throughout the entire challenge (and one time, while digging in the sand, they did actually gray out her chest because I think one finally popped out. I'm thinking you could possibly buy a swimsuit that fits when you know you're going to be doing challenges in it.

quote:

this is how my family enjoyed time together too. My brothers and I connected over Lost In Space and Gilligans Island when we had nothing else in common.

My Dad had was very strict and wouldn't let us watch certain shows. So, when he was really into a show that I wanted to watch, it was SWEET. Dad and I connected over Star Trek and Laugh-In.

quote:

I also loved seeing Lisa do a Tupperware party because she is a natural for rep sales and this is at least a place to begin. The jewelry making thing was just stupid. Couldn't you see her doing Silpada?

See, I thought Lisa + Tupperware was a horrible fit, though I agree she is a natural for sales. I want to buy Tupperware from someone who is homey and a good cook and knows her way around a kitchen (imagine Paula Deen selling Tupperware! LOL). Lisa is none of those things.

What is Silpada? Never heard of it. Assume it's some other homeware sales outfit?

Sheri, you and I watch the same shows, it just cracks me up. I dvr (tvo) everything and watch when I can, so I haven't seen the 2nd half of the new Survivor, but I know the woman you mean. It must be for entertainment value. Just like Idol, they let certain folks on just to spice everything up. I started watching Idol because it was one of the two things my girls will watch together - they are soooo different. (The other show they both watch is Gilmore Girls, which we all adore.)

Before I let myself feel bad for all my entertainment compulsions, I have to remind myself that this is how my family enjoyed time together too. My brothers and I connected over Lost In Space and Gilligans Island when we had nothing else in common. And, Heck, it worked because now we are eachother's biggest fans.

I must say, regarding Kim, that ever since she had the beaten up makeover, I have found my heart for her. I still wish Jill had been around that day because it was so gut-wrenching that Jill would have just melted.

I also loved seeing Lisa do a Tupperware party because she is a natural for rep sales and this is atleast a place to begin. The jewelry making thing was just stupid. Couldn't you see her doing Silpada? Who is advising on these carreer options they are offered! I also thought that real estate was a horrible option for poor Christina. Real estate requires quite a lot of math, don't they know that artsy people (like myself) hate numbers? Yikes.

Lynne

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
But what I felt sad for Kim over was she just looked so lost being told to adjust her expectations. It goes right over her head. It's like a different language.

Yea. Kim has been blocking her emotions and denying her feelings and pain for so long that it is taking forever to get through to her. I keep wanting to warm up to her, but I'm having a hard time. Then again, I had a real hard time warming up to TJ in the beginning too, and ended up liking her in the end.

Don't you wonder whether some of these people ever SAW this show before? I don't get how you sign up for this show and not think you're going to have to face the hard stuff. What did they think this was, The Price is Right?

Kinda like this woman Cirie on the new Survivor last night. She's never even slept outside before and she could barely pick up leaves for the shelter because she was afraid of what (critters, bugs, etc.) might be under them. Honey...have ya ever WATCHED this show? Sheesh.

Hey Sheri, Sorry it's been such a long day. In a good way.

The first thing that comes to mind about the court room scene is how it ended with the choir. That was just insanely great. Not a dry eye in the room. I almost felt like it was Jill's reward, because she wasn't getting what she came expecting. Then, who does? That seems to be the final lesson everyone walks out with, huh?

I was also fascinated this week by Kim's exercise about expectations. What do you want from this person most and what was the strongest emotion you take away from the time you had together? It was interesting to me that the strong feelings she ended up with were consistently not what she went in wanting. I know Ronda was telling her that having rock hard expectations sets you up for disappointment every time. But what I felt sad for Kim over was she just looked so lost being told to adjust her expectations. It goes right over her head. It's like a different language.

I really like Jody. Even though she seems very scarred and has a tephlon exterior, I know she is going to grow like a weed, and I feel that she is ripe for the experience.

Christie isn't ready to turn her back on all her addictions. It just isn't as easy as making a poster and burning it. She wants it to be much easier, and she is stuck in that THIS isn't FAIR world.

And that is all I have to say today Quite enough, right!

Bumping to get Lynne's take on the courtroom drama.

HOLY MOSES!!!!!!! That courtroom episode was really powerful. I felt bad for Jill in a way because she felt that she was graduating either at court or the next day. But Iyanla had dropped that Daddy bomb last week so I had a feeling she wasn't getting off so easy. Plus, she's been saying for WEEKS "I'm graduating." and I think when you get cocky like that, they don't want to give it to you.

That gospel music, as the culmination of all that courtroom drama, was incredible. So THAT's what those people were there for! I was boohooing like nobody's bizness by the end of that, esp. with Jill's Mom hugging her and saying "You done good!"

On a side note, Lisa got a little extra respect from me last night. During the court thing, and especially at the end when Jill was coming through hugging everyone in the jury box, you could see the genuine emotion on Lisa's face. Lisa is so "put on" so much of the time that when I see real, unfettered emotion from her, I feel like she is finally moving forward.

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
Do you think they will ever bring Lisa's parents to her?

If you mean "Lisa #1" (the Lisa that's been in the house the longest), her parents have already visited. I thought you'd been watching long enough to have seen that. I guess it was maybe 2 months ago. It was awkward and, in my mind, Dad sorta blended into the woodwork during the visit and it was mostly about Mom. You see where Lisa gets her judgmental behavior. It's hard to say (because most parents still treat their adult children as kids), but it seemed to me that Lisa's Mom definitely played into the "Lisa as dependent" thing...some of which you heard on the phone last week.

quote:

I know what you're going to say...that as long as she's still alive, there's still a chance to make our relationship better and clear up some of these "wrong perceptions" we have about one another.

Nope, wrong.

Though I sometimes envy people who still have their moms around, I don't think that anything ever gets wrapped up in a neat little package. That's a fantasy. One thing I notice is that I still keep having a growing relationship with my mother in that I keep re-seeing our past and learning new things. Especially now that I have teenagers, I feel so much more understanding toward her choices. There are no perfect mothers, and there are no perfect children.
I enjoy seeing the way these SO ladies do get to have strong bonding moments with their mothers, but I also notice that not all of them do. Look at TJ. Her mom must have done a lot wrong, but her journey was never about that. Do you think they will ever bring Lisa's parents to her?

Lynne

quote:

Originally posted by mountaingirl:
Do you still have your Mom, Sheri?

Yes, but our relationship is strained and I have never felt like I could be honest with her because she gets massively defensive at the drop of a hat. She's always reading something into what I say that isn't there. Conversely, she pushes my buttons so automatically these days that I have a hard time just hearing what she's saying and not reacting out of habit/past hurts.

I know what you're going to say...that as long as she's still alive, there's still a chance to make our relationship better and clear up some of these "wrong perceptions" we have about one another. I agree that there is a chance. But, after something that happened last summer with our family that centered around my mother, and after the things she said to my brothers and I as a result of it, I really don't have much desire at this point to risk pushing that envelope.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Sheri in Reho,

Do you still have your Mom, Sheri?