aack, I'm struggling!
I totally buy into the wisdom I've read here and in journal to banish too-tempting, not good for you foods form the house. But I see a little behavior growing in me that I find disturbing: foods that i earlier would not have been tempted to overeat I now am.
I made the pb truffles and gorged like a maniac. I see others make them and obviously do well with them and it amazes me--cuttingthose little portions and wrapping them. I turn into a monster of desire/gluttony.
I started to gorge peanut butter, which is a healthy and excellent food to have around for kids and husband and myself ( i thought.) I switched to crunchy since it is not my favorite to see if that helps.
Then I pigged out on nuts in a way I wouldn't have before.
Then string cheese.
Aak.
These are not junk fooods, but I am eating them desperately, even with three well-planned meals and two snacks--ok, not always!

Been here?
Dana

Ok, cool, i got a lot of ways to think about journaling.

And Denise, this had me hooting in my chair:

quote:

I'd write:
7/8 med bagel (gave one bite to the dog), about 3.5 inches across, some whole wheat, but not 100% whole wheat

So I stopped because I was driving myself crazy (and who knows who else!)

It's funny, too cause I think I've been really worried about keeping too much track of eating because I don't want to have eating/food on the brain a lot; i associate that with a time in my life when i was really anxious about eating/body.

Anyway, too much to say on that here!
thanks,
d

When I was in weight loss mode, I journaled by counting calories. Basically my journal was a bunch of numbers for the food piece and then I added in how much I exercised and the emotional component too.

Then I did fitday tracking for a while and now I usually just post menus/actuals in the "whats for dinner thread".

When I'm back in weight loss mode, I usually go back to calorie counting as I need to be eating around 1200 calories/day to lose and that takes more discipline on my part and requires journaling to make it happen ; )

quote:

Originally posted by d.maya:
Hey, can anyone tell me about "journaling" re:food.
Is there anything to know?
Help/guidelines?

Play around. There are lots of ways to journal.

I've journaled just like Sheri described with foods and amounts. Except instead of breakfast or lunch, I write the time. (My RD wanted that info... and I thought it was helpful, also.)

Some people also journal their emotions at the time or where they are or their hunger level - but I never have.

* * * * * * *

I've also used www.fitday.com

I thought it was really interesting. I'm sort of half thinking of doing it again... but it is a little tedious. (More tedious than pen and paper for me)

* * * * * *

I've written out a plan for the next day and have put a sticker on the calendar every day when I've actually stuck to my plan.

(You could type out Lynn's quote "Success was the first habit I had to learn, and for me that meant just simply learning to eat what I intended to eat - to eat on plan, as some of us here say" and attach it to your calendar and put smiley stickers )

* * * * * * * *

I've used KD's (and Peg’s) 5 point system where you give your self a point or smiley for:

food
exercise not today
water (still have one glass to go!)
me time
and I posted

I think of it as Peg's system now, since she uses it a lot.

* * * * *

I've journaled up in the "What's for dinner" thread. I kind of got obsessive. I didn't care if people saw what I ate. I didn't mind posting that I ate an apple fritter the size of a dinner plate. I got obsessive about accuracy and amounts (like anybody really cared... )

Like I couldn't write:
med bagel

I'd write:
7/8 med bagel (gave one bite to the dog), about 3.5 inches across, some whole wheat, but not 100% whole wheat

So I stopped because I was driving myself crazy (and who knows who else!)

* * * * *

I've used Weight Watchers logs. They have a place to log food and also some little boxes to check off for water, fruits/vegs, etc.

* * * * * * *

One system that I like, my mom taught me. I put an X for a whole serving and a / for half a serving. (Using standard serving sizes - like 1/2 c. of ice cream. I don't put an X when I have a bowl with 2 cups of ice cream in it. )
Grains XXXX/
fruit XXXX
dairy XX/
Meat/eggs/protein XX
nuts /
oils XX
beans X
green leafy vegs XX
yellow veg X
other vegs XX
alcohol 1/4
sweets X

This has been my favorite journaling system so far. I often look at the log and decided to change my snack based on what I need.

Once in a while, I end up with a day with 10 servings of grain (ie bread and pasta) and one serving of veggies. But more often than not, I eat better journaling this way and am more likely to have fruit or vegs for a snack instead of a quesadilla or yet more servings of toast and jam.

quote:

Originally posted by d.maya:
I got really emotional reading them, so there is obviously a lot of emotion in this eating.

Sending you a virtual hug!

I have this humongous word file filled with my binging stuff and tons of links to articles I've found helpful or interesting.

I bumped it up.

quote:

Originally posted by d.maya:
Hey, can anyone tell me about "journaling" re:food.
Is there anything to know?
Help/guidelines?

Food journalling is most helpful when it's really honest; i.e., includes all the little things that we can so easily forget that we've consumed throughout the day. I write down everything I eat (and drink, if that has calories) and try to include quantities as much as possible given the limited space. Like 2.5 oz. grilled chicken, 1/2 cup skim milk, 1 serving gingersnaps, etc. Things that I eat with some regularity I know the serving size of by heart, so I can say "1 serving gingersnaps" and know that means 5 small cookies.

In KD's new journal, I write B: at the far left and then keep my writing of what I ate for breakfast to about an inch wide. Then I draw a line down and my AM snack or lunch goes next. I keep going like that until I've worked my way across the page, left to right, and end up with my evening snack at the far right edge. I also try to write above the meal what time I ate it so that I can keep an eye on whether I'm eating often enough.

ps denise, thanks for all your awesome feedback.
i wanted to clarify that i didn't mean i ever skipped meals or snacks; i don't.
just that i don't always PLAN them, and that sets me up for a milk-guzzling, pb-eating session while i figure out "what to eat."
not good.

Oh, thanks so much, everyone.
These are really deep and reflective responses.
I got really emotional reading them, so there is obviously a lot of emotion in this eating.

JEn/Trigirl--I was thinking of Geneen Roth's books the other day, too, becasue they helped me so much at one time! Thank you for reminding me of her name and work! It is scary to go back to that, but necessary, I think.

Peg--thanks for questions/ideas. Planning is a big area I need to work on.
Lynn-- I'm putting this on my wall!

"Success was the first habit I had to learn, and for me that meant just simply learning to eat what I intended to eat - to eat on plan, as some of us here say.Success was the first habit I had to learn, and for me that meant just simply learning to eat what I intended to eat - to eat on plan, as some of us here say."
thank you!

Denise on triggers and rat study--cool.

Lots of honesty and smarts on emotions, triggers, etc.


Hey, can anyone tell me about "journaling" re:food.
Is there anything to know?
Help/guidelines?
I'll post this if no one sees it.

I think when we ban foods, behavior or emotions it usually comes back to bite us. We take out a food and call it bad vs good. Why not just what is a better choice? I could go all day long without eatting but when I had to go in for a surgery- they would say no food or drink after midnight. Wouldn't you know I would wake up one minute after midnight and crave everything even a drink of water?! We just don't like to be told no or can't have. It is our human nature.
I like to journal. It takes awhile to get use to doing all the time but it showed me several things. One I do a lot of negative talking to myself about food. Have a lot of rules. It shows me weakness' and strong areas. I can see visually when I fall off the healthy band wagon or am not exercising enough. I found it isn't about bad foods it is about a healthy life style. I am reading a book now by Gwen Shamblin- "The Weigh Down Diet". It isn't about dieting though just healthy choices and a new way to thinking. So far I have gotten many good ideas to replace some bad habbits of mine. They are important ones and have stuck. I think it is important that each of us enjoy the support on this site and others, encourage each other as we go, learn to be good to ourselves and realize this isn't about dieting but rather good choices we make for ourselves and the ones we love.

I agree -- if you get rid of all the snack foods, if you get the urge to binge, you will automatically be drawn to whatever the snackiest or most "forbidden" food you have left around is. Some foods, like Doritos, are just triggers, but I have had times where I ate three bowls of Cheerios, or couldn't stop munching on pumpkin seeds, or cherries, or whatever was around. This is a behavior that I'm still working on -- most of the time I'm OK, but sometimes when I'm feeling sad, it's hard not to look for something to munch.

I think that at the same time that you are working on cleaning up your diet, you have to do some head work too. There has to be a reason you are driven to overeat. Hunger could be it, or stress, or putting off something you don't want to do, or anger, or ...

Geneen Roth has some good books on binge eating that may be helpful to you in tracking this down. I've also worked with a therapist at different times when I just needed someone neutral to talk things out with.

Dana, I really hear you.

I think that when we have gotten used to using food to comfort us, we still tend to fall into that behavior -- hence, even though you've banished certain foods, you haven't automatically eliminated the urge to snack.

I remember when I visited my grandma, she never kept "junk" in the house (exception was when she baked pies or made donuts). So if I wanted to snack I had to search out raisins, pork & beans, cottage cheese ... Definitely better for you than cookies loaded with trans fats, but you get my point, the behavior was still there!

At certain times in my life, a change in attitude/mindset was possible; other times, much more of a challenge.

Grace

quote:

Originally posted by cobismom:
Some of this "gourging" behavior has to be stopped not by banning food, but by fixing your brain. In order to stop a certain behavior, your brain has to kick in another behavior to replace it. In otherwords, if you are trying to stop grazing on foods, you have to have some self control. I had to admit that even KD's granola can be over done...and if I didn't want to leave it entirely alone, I'd have to admit it was a problem for me, measure out and package portion packages and then say "NO" to the little girl in me that wanted more. It's a mind game, and your mind has to be playing to win.

So true!!! This relates to Sheri's homework today and changing mental thoughts/behaviors. You have to figure out why you are binging. But remember, don't beat yourself up. We have all been there(I still am). Start planning your next meal/snack, make it a healthy one and try to let go of the negative feelings you have about overdoing it on the gorging.
JIll

Are you letting yourself get too hungry? I know there are many reasons for binge eating. I am not a binge eater for the most part. The only time I binge eat, or go into a "feeding frenzy" as I have referred to it in the past is when I have let myself get too hungry. I mean REALLY, REALLY hungry. It has only happened a hand full of times in my life, and it was truly scary.

I also wonder, if in connection with your other post, you aren't drinking so much milk that you don't really feel hungry, but your body is craving more real food and you end up over compensating.

Dawn

quote:

Originally posted by d.maya:
Then I pigged out on nuts in a way I wouldn't have before...
These are not junk fooods, but I am eating them desperately, even with three well-planned meals and two snacks--ok, not always!

Dana, you MUST eat your meals and snacks. Skipping meals and then binging (even on healthy foods) isn't condusive to losing weight, physical health or mental/emotional health.

I found the following article about studies done on binging rats.

Dangers of Mixing Stress, Deprivation and Tempting Foods

Quote: The researchers speculate that the deprived and stressed rats may have been in a "hedonic deprivation state," essentially craving something good and rewarding. The research underscores how what is viewed as an unhealthy behavior (indulging in palatable foods, which are cheap, convenient and often high in fat and sugar) may have its roots in the need to survive. It suggests that binge eating is an adaptive response to abnormal environmental conditions. Boggiano cites other scientists' findings that among healthy people without eating disorders, dieting [aka skipping meals, cutting calories too much, eliminating food groups, etc.] is the biggest predictor of stress-induced overeating.

Full article at:

http://www.ediets.com/news/article.cfm/cmi_1557948

PS... I do like your sense of humor though and the thought of banishing more and more foods until you're like Mother Hubbard with bare cupboards.

quote:

Originally posted by d.maya:
But I see a little behavior growing in me that I find disturbing: foods that i earlier would not have been tempted to overeat I now am.
Been here?

Ohhh yeaaaa, I've been there...still am! Even after 2 1/2 years of eating healthy, I still find myself with that little behavior. I crave (I mean, monstrously crave, not just kinda want--a feeling that I call "cragin'") things that I never craved before. It has puzzled me for some time now.

One of my strategies with it is to buy things in single servings. For example, if I am craving something like a donut, I will get ONE Krispy Kreme donut while I'm at the grocery store (they sell them in the bakery section) and that way I know I can't overindulge. Or if I want a cookie, I buy ONE chocolate chip cookie while I'm grocery shopping at Whole Foods.

As I posted last week, I live alone so I know that, if it comes in my door, it's likely going in my mouth at some point. So I can't afford to bring in a whole box or package of anything that I know I won't be able to exercise control with.

Dana,

I guess you have to ask yourself what are your immediate goals and what is this behavior doing to them? Are you trying to eat better as a baby step toward weightloss and fitness? If you have a lot of bad eating habits to break, then be careful about breaking them all at once because you need to build success, and confidence in the process first. Success was the first habit I had to learn, and for me that meant just simply learning to eat what I intended to eat - to eat on plan, as some of us here say. When you teach yourself to have what you decided to have, and stop there, you really have a powerful tool under your belt (literally)! You can go anywhere and be with anyone, and know that you are going to eat as you choose, not as something else dictates. This was step one for me, and it continues to be the cornerstone of my satisfaction with my eating.

I have a binge mentality also, so I had to find safe binge foods for those times when it I want to tune out. The best binge food for me when I just want to keep popping something is fruit. The only real drawback is I get bloated shortly after I've noshed on a bag of grapes. But it never really results in bad gains.

Hope this helps

Lynne

Honey, I am always there. That is one of my big issues. I call myself MacGuyver of snacky foods.

I love Bisquick, know why?? Because it is not a snack food. I buy it to make pancakes and stuff for the kids. My one son loves the bisquits I make with it.

I love Bisquick because at any moment I have the tools I need to make a coffee cake.

I am there!! It is the love of snacking. The desire for a sweet that drives me to make anything I can to snack on even though I know I should not.

Don't worry, it is normal, just something you need to take control of. Don't make the truffles if you can't eat just one.

Some of this "gourging" behavior has to be stopped not by banning food, but by fixing your brain. In order to stop a certain behavior, your brain has to kick in another behavior to replace it. In otherwords, if you are trying to stop grazing on foods, you have to have some self control. I had to admit that even KD's granola can be over done...and if I didn't want to leave it entirely alone, I'd have to admit it was a problem for me, measure out and package portion packages and then say "NO" to the little girl in me that wanted more. It's a mind game, and your mind has to be playing to win.

I still struggle with wanting to gorge on something, but it is usually "cheese flavored styrofoam" (aka quaker cheese flavored mini rice cakes). So, I rarely buy them. Even portioned out, they are extras in my daily calories, they don't get factored in (which neither I nor my nutritionist like). So, they still will remain banned.

One thing I have noticed is that I no longer gorge quite like I used to. Once upon a time, I could easily eat an entire batch of raw cookie dough. (And did.) Now, I still munch a little bit when I make cookies, but I find I can only eat a little bit before I start feeling sick to my stomach. (Sensory overload.)

I often can trace my gorging to some mental or emotional stress. If I've spent some time with my journal, I often find I'm too lazy when I'm done to make the effort to make/go get the trigger food.

If I allow myself a small amount of cheese or other things that could be trigger foods each day, I rarely overindulge. But they get factored into my daily calories, and my nutritionist is well aware of those foods. (Which I purposely told her about.)

Dana,
I'm going to go on a different tangent here and ask you some things that may seem irrelevent but might really be at the root of some of it. If not, no loss but thought I'd give you some things to think about adding/doing instead of subtracting/avoiding. It sounds to me as if you are sort of getting stuck in that diet place where you are eliminating things.

1. Do you have a plan for the day? I encourage you to sit down and take 5 min (I do it most nights before bed as the last thing I do before I shut off the computer for example) and plan the next day's food. I personally post it on What's for Dinner but you can put it in your journal, on a piece of paper on the fridge, whatever works. This plan can and should, at least for a while, include all 3 meals and snacks.

2. Do you need to start tracking something? There is a whole assortment of things you can choose to track...calories, servings, exchanges, glasses of water, etc. I know you have little ones so make it fast and simple....FitDay is great but honestly it takes a lot of time, especially in the beginning. If it makes more sense to just track servings of Fruits/Veggies, Protein, Dairy, Grains a day with check marks or whatever, that works too.

3. Do you want to take a look at journaling a little bit? Especially around feelings when you are eating this stuff you wish you weren't (or at least not in the quantities you currently are). It could be that this is really emotional eating and if that is the case, continuing to banish foods from the house is not going to solve the problem.

4. I suspect sleep may be at a premium at your house. Can you find a way to add some additional minutes if you think you are in a deficit?

HTH!

Peg