Originally posted by Bill: Yes, there are a few places around me that I can practice on. Nothing close to the trail I described, but I can always walk up and down the trails to get an idea.
There isn't ANYTHING close to approximate a day of snow skiing here... but being in better physical shape REALLY, REALLY helps!!
I've skied over weight and out-of-shape... and I've skied thinner and after consistent exercise... and I don't have to tell you which is better.
Yes, I agree that this is going to be tough; and I expect to be exhausted when it's over. Right after I posted the description, I entered the what-in-the-world-was-I-thinking stage. Yes, there are a few places around me that I can practice on. Nothing close to the trail I described, but I can always walk up and down the trails to get an idea. And I WILL do this.
The other thing that I have not mentioned is that my friends said that they would be happy to join me under the condition that if at any time any one of us wants to turn back, we all agree to do so. No ifs, ands, or buts. Knowing that I can push the "panic" button if I need to is what is allowing me to be a little more ambitious.
Having said all of that, please know that I thank you both very, very much for having the courage to tell me this. This is not something that should be undertaken with rose-colored glasses. Thank you, my friends!
Originally posted by Bill: The distances from the head of The Piper Trail to the summit (which is 3500’) is 4.3 miles, 2700 ft. of elevation, and an approximate travel time of 3 hr. 30 min.
I agree with Peg... this time sounds VERY optimistic... even if it is one way...
And do get some shorter hikes in... get off the treadmill and the pavement... think of it as training.
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I also have to say that this expedition is really helping to make the daily exercise so much more tolerable.
I still don't really enjoy the daily grind of exercise... but I enjoy my leisure time sooooooo much more when I'm in shape.
The distances from the head of The Piper Trail to the summit (which is 3500’) is 4.3 miles, 2700 ft. of elevation, and an approximate travel time of 3 hr. 30 min.
Bill, So you are looking at a 7-8 hour hike here. You will want to think about doing some shorter training hikes between now and then. I do hikes of this distance only a few times a year. They are a wonderful day but you are exhausted when you are done. 8.6 miles is one thing but that elevation gain is substantial. Do you think you'll have some opportunity to do some training hikes?
I love my Montrail boots. I'm glad to hear they are so comfy already. That'll just get better and better. The training hikes also help with breaking those in.
I agree that snow hiking is not a lot of fun unless you are really prepared for it and I definitely wouldn't recommend it to a new hiker.
I’ve been trying to think of ways to describe this trail and decided that the probably the best way to do it is to use the description from the White Mountain Guide, 26th Edition
Piper Trail
It is one of the most heavily used trails in the White Mountains. The trail, running first on a newly constructed section, enters the woods, swings right across a stream, and follows it for 0.3 mi., then turns first sharp left, then right to join a wood road that is the old route of the trail. The trail follows the logging road across the White Mountain National Forest boundary at 0.5 mi, where there is a trail register. The Weetamoo Trail diverges left at 0.6 mi., and the Nickerson Ledge Trail diverges right at 1.2 mi.
After crossing Chocorua River (a small brook at this point) at 1.8 mi., the trail ascends moderately past a cleared outlook that affords a view up to Carter Ledge, then climbs up a series of switchbacks with stone steps and paving. At 2.8 mi., a spur path diverges left 0.2 mi. to Camp Penacook (open shelter, tent platform, water). The main trail turns sharp right at this junction and ascends, with more stone steps and paving, soon reaching open ledges with spectacular views to the north, east, and south. The Champney Falls Trail enters right at 3.6 mi., and in another 0.2 mi., the West Side Trail enters on the right. The Piper Trail, marked with yellow paint, continues over open ledges to the junction with the Brook Trail, then swings left and climbs the rock gully to the summit.
The distances from the head of The Piper Trail to the summit (which is 3500’) is 4.3 miles, 2700 ft. of elevation, and an approximate travel time of 3 hr. 30 min.
I did also find this caution:
The extensive areas of open ledge that make Chocorua so attractive also pose a very real danger. Many of the trails have ledgy sections that are dangerous when wet or icy, and the summit and upper ledges are severely exposed to lightning during electrical storms. Despite its comparatively modest elevation, Chocorua is one the most dangerous peaks in the White Mountains in a thunderstorm. The safety of any untreated water source in this heavily used area is very doubtful. Although Chocorua is relatively low compared to the other major White Mountain peaks, its trailheads are also located at low elevations, resulting in a substantial amount of elevation gain that makes Chocorua as strenuous a trip as many much higher peaks.
I found this website which, if you follow the links, will show views from the mountain.
Although I am sobered by the cautions, I am still looking forward to this trip.
I did make it to REI yesterday. I spent a little over an hour choosing boots. Amazingly, I ended up with the first pair I tried on. I really love them. They are Montrail Torre GTX. I am wearing them now—and have been since 8:00 this morning. Very comfortable! The socks are something called “Smartwool.” I cannot believe that these are wool. I’ve never worn such comfortable socks.
Oh, someone asked what weather I’m expecting. At the end of September, it can be in the 50s or the 80s. My friends do not want to go after Columbus Day because the possibility of snow increases dramatically. Truly, the weather forecast is the only thing that is worrying me. If we’re not sure of a fairly decent day, we will cancel. (A little rain or cold is not the problem, but I’m not up for snow.)
I hoped this is what you all were looking for. Oh, I did check out the websites that you all recommended. Thank you! I really like the REI info section. And the Sierra and Campmor sites are wonderful for comparison shopping. (Great pictures of the equipment.)
I also have to say that this expedition is really helping to make the daily exercise so much more tolerable. When I’m faltering on the treadmill, I say, “Well, you can’t just stop and go to the locker room when you’re on a trail now, can you!”
Oh, thank you all for your suggestions! Unfortunately, I spent too much time responding to the Journal that I have to run. I will get more details for you all. And thanks for all the website suggestions! I'm hoping to take time this afternoon to check them out.
You need a back pack that fits well to be comfortable.
I have this old external frame back pack with a hip belt... I NEED a hip belt. I HATE all the weight hanging off my shoulders! I love this old pack.
The other "accessory" that I LOVE is hiking poles… Or ski poles…
I have an old pair of ski poles (Thrift Town - $3).
Confession time… I got “brainwashed” by advertising and bought some hi-tech, expensive Leki hiking poles with springs and telescoping poles, etc. I have buyers remorse and I like the ski poles better. I worry about the telescoping and springs and stuff giving out on my cool, expensive brand name poles. I don’t worry about that with the raggedy old ski poles.
I have gone backpacking for 3 days (when I was 30 lbs heavier than I am now) with 25 lb pack… which can make you unstable… I tend to fall going down hill, have never fallen going up hill. I have not fallen once since I started using the poles…
Oh… is there water (streams?) on the mountain? A water filter is lighter than a BUNCH of bottles of water.
And a hint… I lot of people THINK that they have giardia - but it is really from not washing hands after going potty . Don’t share your trail mix…
I am sitting here with the BIGGEST grin on my face. I'm so excited for you!
Tell us a little more about this particular hike. What is the total distance and elevation gain? What do you expect temps/precip to be at that time of the year?
The socks are not in any sort of plastic so you'll be able to feel them. Start wearing your boots for an hour or 2 in the house right away. They can take quite a while to break in.
Packs. Don't think you'll need an frame. You do probably want a waist belt though so that the weight rides on your hips. You'll need to decide what you want to do about hydration before you make a choice of packs. If you want to use a hydration pouch (like a camelbak or platypus), you'll want to buy a pack that accomodates that and the water tube. If you want to use bottles (and if you do, I recommend getting Nalgene bottles), you need to have external pockets to hold them so you can get to them. I think some packs do both. You are looking for a daypack and you'll want to get one big enough for stuff but not so big that you are carrying more than need be. Probably created more questions than answers there. One other thought is that you can rent a backpack from REI if you just want to see how much you like hiking.
I sent e-mail to my friends yesterday and received a very enthusiastic reply. They are just as excited about hiking this mountain as I am! The shock has worn off. Now I'm feeling like a little boy the day before Christmas! I just can't sit still. Remind me of this when I'm going through the what-was-I-thinking stage
We've tentatively planned for the last weekend in September. Oh, my brain is just flying here trying to make a plan of all the things I'll need to do for this trip. Breathe in, breathe out, breathe in, breathe out.
Again, thanks for your input on socks. I did not get to REI yesterday. It's on the list again today and probably will happen as the contractor and his crew will be here today and tomorrow to replace my roof. I've been told that I don't need to be home so I'm planning to not be.
I do want to be a little clearer here. I do plan to get hiking boots. I'm going to explain my preferences to the staff and ask if they have samples of the socks out of their packages so that I can actually touch them before buying.
So next question, please: Packs. Frame? No frame? Waist belt? Other features? I do not plan to spend the night on any mountain (voluntarily, that is); but from the recommended lists of necessary items (especially the just-in-case clothing), it sounds like the pack needs to be larger than a kid's book bag (I was not planning to use one of those), but I am also not planning a 7-day trek. Any thoughts?
Oh, I just know that I'm going to go on sensory overload when I get to REI. It happens anyway when I'm there. I just love to walk around and look at outdoor stuff. (I used to do this at Home Depot when they first opened their doors. Testosterone can be an ugly thing.)
I used to hike pretty regularly, but now it's more like short ambles (.5 - 1 mile) to the creek. We are planning on a 8 mile hike w/packs to Havasupai Falls in 2 weeks, for my birthday:
As far as socks go, cotton is bad bad bad. They hold onto moisture, rather than letting it evaporate, and that can lead to cold feet, blisters, and a host of other evils.
Soon you'll get to know and love technical fabrics ... ones that "wick away" moisture -- to keep you dry (and thus warm) in the winter, and keep you cool (thanks to rapid evaporation) in the summer.
Wool is a natural technical fabric, because it has this wicking ability. But there are other, chemically-made fabrics, that go by a host of brand names, like Gore-Tex, Comfortrel, Omni-Tech, etc. These work just as well both in socks, and in clothing. They are usually very light as well. There are also blends of the two.
RE: boots, for a beginning hiker, or on rough, steep, or uneven terrain, ankle support is key. I like some arch support too. I usually add some insoles as well, cuz I like to be comfy. You'll probably want to by a 1/2 size larger as well, because usually people's feet swell when they hike.
For distance hikes, you're looking for low weight as well. If you're going to be hiking in the snow, look for ones that are lined, or have enough room in them for you to wear thick socks, and you'll want them to be waterproof.
It's kind of sneaky, but you can try them on in the store, and then buy them cheaper online. Or buy them online LONG before your hike, so you have time to send them back and order new ones.
Overall, hiking is a very inexpensive activity. Your biggest expense will be outfitting your feet -- but it is essential for an enjoyable experience. Everything else is just icing.
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Posts: 1421 | Location: Phoenix, AZ | Registered: March 11, 2004
Are these wool socks that you speak of the same scratchy type?
I don't find my wool socks scratchy at all. The Thorlos are synthetic so you might try those first if you are particularly vulnerable to wool. I don't have very sensitive skin.
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Well, that's not the main question. Should I try hiking socks with sneakers to try to find something I like before searching for boots? Do you think the experience will be the same in sneakers as it will be in the boots?
That might work well. I personally didn't do that and the first set of socks were tearing my feet up. I thought it was the boots but then someone suggested I try different socks and that did the trick. I don't know that the experience will be exactly the same in sneakers vs. boots but you would probably get a pretty good idea AND it would make hiking in sneakers more comfy at least because you wouldn't have wet cotton socks on.
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I'm concerned that if I just pick a pair of socks at the store and try on boots, if I find the boots I love but end up hating the socks, where do I go from there? I'm going on the assumption that it's less expensive to change socks than boots.
It is much less expensive to change socks (although the first time I paid around $15 for a pair of socks I about croaked! ). You might find yourself trying sock liners and different brands of socks but it is sooooo worth it when you figure out the right combo. Again, the sales staff should be able to help you match sock and boot but that was one thing that didn't work for me. Again, relatively inexpensive problem to solve.
I have never been seriously into hiking and what little I've done has been in sneakers. I did attempt to buy a pair of hiking boots once, but they weren't REAL hiking boots and not high quality. Like Denise, my boots broke me in before I broke them in and I have rarely worn them as a result.
As for socks, I heard raves about Thorlo's back when I first joined the gym in 1998 so I bought 2 pair (1 hightop, 1 ankle). I found that, even though I buy my sneakers a 1/2 size too large to allow for thicker socks, the Thorlo's were just SO thick that my feet always felt cramped and awful. I still have them cuz I love to wear them around the house in the winter to keep my tootsies warm!
I bought a 3-pak of Reebok sox at Kohl's earlier this year and I love them. They are padded on the sole but not on the instep, which is the absolute key for me personally as far as comfort goes. I started wearing them on my powerwalks outside as well as to the gym for my Saturday morning aerobics class. They have made such a difference in my comfort level and endurance that I went out and bought another 3-pak this summer.
Posts: 7233 | Location: Rehoboth Beach, DE | Registered: March 12, 2004
Of course, this leads me to another question. I think I am going to ask the classic which came first, the chicken or the egg.
Other than occasional dress-up situations, I wear either cotton tube socks or the ankle-length version of the same. I do not like the feel of traditional wool socks. Are these wool socks that you speak of the same scratchy type?
Well, that's not the main question. Should I try hiking socks with sneakers to try to find something I like before searching for boots? Do you think the experience will be the same in sneakers as it will be in the boots?
I'm concerned that if I just pick a pair of socks at the store and try on boots, if I find the boots I love but end up hating the socks, where do I go from there? I'm going on the assumption that it's less expensive to change socks than boots.
I'm also hoping to get to REI today to try to chat with the boots people. It may not happen because it's really at the bottom of today's to-do list.
Ray Jardine, author of Pacific Crest Trail Hiker's Handbook, has thru hiked Pacific Crest Trail, Continental Divide Trail and Appalachian Trail in running shoes. He actually has some compelling arguments for not wearing hiking boots.
I lived in the foothills near Sequoia National Park for 5 years and walked about a mile to work every day and hiked all over the property (3,500 acres and lots of rattle snakes…) and never wore hiking boots. I had one pair but they were never comfortable and they broke me in before I broke them in and I couldn't afford really good ones. I’ve hiked Mt. Lassen in running shoes (and a skirt… easier and faster to pee outside in a skirt.)
I think that it is better to go a little slower, watch your step and avoid snakes. Avoid putting your feet/ankles in precarious situations and get your muscles/legs/ankles in good shape so that they can support you… IMHO.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: GoingSkiing,
All I can offer is to really take your time in making sure the boots fit right. It took my dh 6 stores and multiple brands before he found the right hiking boots.
I also agree on making sure you take the right thickness of socks with you because that will make a big difference.
I too was able to find last year's style on clearance and got a great pair of weather proof boots for a bargain but it was pure luck.
Out of our beliefs are born deeds; out of our deeds we form habits; out of our habits grows our character; and on our character we build our destiny.
I second Peg. If you are walking on anything other than a paved trail, you really want boots that will support your ankle. Sneakers just don't offer than. One bad step, a twisted ankle and there you are miles from your car.
I ditto the water proofing, not only for creaks and strems that you have to cross, but, in my case, rain, mud etc...
Again, I agree with her on socks. You want to make sure they breathe and don't rub you the wrong way *he he* as blisters are not a hikers friend. Also, may sure you try the boots on with at least the thickness of the sock that you will be wearing. Walk around the store a lot in these boots prior to purchasing. When you do purchase, you have to break them in. Walk around the block at a few different intervals, wear them to the grocery store etc.. before taking them on a hike. Once broken in, they will most likely be the most comfortable shoes you've ever owned.
On price, I picked up last years model at quite a deep discount. My feet don't care if they're stylish.
. Don’t share your trail mix…
